MICHAEL ANTHONY Says VAN HALEN's ROCK HALL Induction Was 'A Pretty Bittersweet Thing'
- July 28, 2009
Although both Sammy Hagar and Michael Anthony were inducted into the Rock And Roll Hall of Fame in 2007 with VAN HALEN, the band never performed at the induction since Eddie and Alex Van Halen were no-shows at the event.
Artisan News Service recently caught up with Hagar and Anthony to get their thoughts on the induction.
"You know, it was a pretty bittersweet thing for me," said Anthony "It was uncomfortable. It was one of the greatest nights, you know, one of the biggest accolades a person in the business can have. To be recognized for everything that we've done. I remember turning to Sammy, I think R.E.M. was playing and we were going, 'Man, it should have been us.'" Sammy added, "It could have been. Like the way METALLICA did it this last year, they brought both bass players. The brought the father of the bass player that died, Cliff, and they all played together. That's the way you're supposed to do it at an event like that. So, it wasn't cool, I don't care what anybody says — I'll dog those guys the rest of my life for not doing that — but for me not to be there, or Mike not to be there, are you kidding? Like I said, it would take a shotgun to keep me from being there. It's an honor to be brought into the Rock And Roll Hall of Fame and I'm going to show up if I'm invited, you know?! It's as simple as that."
Watch video footage of Hagar and Anthony talking about the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame induction at this location.
Hagar and Anthony are currently playing together in CHICKENFOOT, which also includes guitar virtuoso Joe Satriani and RED HOT CHILI PEPPERS drummer Chad Smith.
CHICKENFOOT's self-titled debut album has sold 247,000 copies in the United States since its June 5 release, according to Nielsen SoundScan. The LP is packaged in heat-sensitive artwork, which means when you put your hand on the CD inlay, photos of the band members are revealed behind the CHICKENFOOT band logo.
The band will launch its first major North American tour on August 2 in Halifax, Nova Scotia, finishing up on September 27 in Universal City, California.
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COMMENT | God Bless Michael posted by : RiotAct666 7/28/2009 9:50:37 AM
He is a class act and good guy. Too bad VH didn't perform when they got inducted in 2007. It would have been very cool i bet to see them rock out at that event. You can all thank Eddie & Alex for that.
COMMENT | hagar/roth posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 9:55:34 AM
can we agree on this, Hagar heads, they were in the HOF for their DLR years. While they sold a ton of records in the Hagar years, you know that snobby committee isn't voting in a pop/rock Hagar lead VH...hagar was riding coattails that night.
COMMENT | posted by : Skanna 7/28/2009 10:15:56 AM
yeah, nice one Ed. no new music since 98 either.
COMMENT | I disagree posted by : Rokkaholik 7/28/2009 10:29:55 AM
I believe that VH was inducted because of BOTH era's contributions to the music world. People can slag on either version for any reason, but it doesn't change the fact that BOTH have their place in history.
I do agree, however, that the VH brothers not showing up was a complete disrespect for both the fans as well as the history of their music.
Sadly, I don't really see VH ever being a relavant band again unless Eddie can get his shit straightened out and get his overly massive ego put in check.
Well, EVH was in rehab, and you know how DLR is. Not sure what Alex's problem is - he's as much of an a-hole as his younger brother is. What a collection of moody motherfuckers.
COMMENT | posted by : juanneman 7/28/2009 10:33:18 AM
The VH's and Roth prove themselves stupid. At least Metallica have been waaaaaaaaaaay classier than these douches. I do not get it how people can be like that.
COMMENT | ^^^^ posted by : jrqberry 7/28/2009 10:41:39 AM
Because they have the mindset that it's "all about them." And, ironically, that night should've been all about the VH's & Roth as well as Sam & Mike. But they couldn't (still can't) get a handle on those egos. If they really cared about the fans, and not 150% about themselves, they would have kept it together for the last 15 years. If they did that, they would still be relevant. Now, sadly, they are just fodder for internet arguements.
COMMENT | posted by : booch 7/28/2009 10:44:07 AM
Velvet Revolver was the wrong band to perform in VH's place. Not so good.
COMMENT | BSlash24 - No we can not agree posted by : wil t 7/28/2009 10:48:31 AM
BSlash...it looks like we disagree again. :) Both line-ups of Van Halen were awesome. Roth and Hagar both offer different things. Roth wrote some bad ass songs and is a phenomenal showman. He wrote some cheesy songs...but who cares. Hagar wrote some great songs too...also some cheesy...but again, they were very good songs. The musicianship that was displayed on all VH albums is phenomenal. It all comes down to taste. You're never going to get a Roth fan to acknowledge Hagar's superior musicianship or singing ability, and you're never going to get a Hagar fan to acknowledge Roth's superior showmanship and his appeal. The entire catalog should be respected for it's overall superiority to most bands.
COMMENT | inducted for both eras, period posted by : destroyer71 7/28/2009 10:51:52 AM
it's really not accurate to say that they were inducted only for the Roth years. Obviously, more people got interested in their music during the Hagar years, as evidenced by the greater album sales. Were they a little more pop-oriented? Sure. But so what? They were incredibly successful with both. Obviously people have their preferences; I liked both equally.
Also, it should be noted that the "induction speech" for VH provided by Velvet Revolver was probably the worst induction speech I've ever heard at the Rock Hall of Fame. What a freaking joke. If ever a "do-over" was appropriate for an induction, this is certainly it.
Truth is, Mike and Sammy are class acts; Ed and Roth are egomaniacs.
COMMENT | posted by : steve_oz_49 7/28/2009 10:57:42 AM
wow 247,000 copies sold! I didn't expect that many sales. This is a good band with some historical members.... I bought the CD and I am very happy with it. It isn't a CD that I can put in while lounging around the house, it's more of a background CD for me. Like if I am out in the yard, out in the garage... stuff like that.
I like both Roth and Hagar..... My opinion is that the Roth era was more explosive with huge shows. The Hagar era... I think that Sammy made Eddie a better musician by urging him to incorporate his piano skills, thus making the band better "musically". The Cherone CD just wasn't right..... Gary is a great guy with a great voice, but he needs to be with Nuno to make it work.
COMMENT | Mike 'Biff' Anthony posted by : DLR_EngineRoom 7/28/2009 11:01:27 AM
...and Sammy 'STFU' Hagar
What a great bunch of all-around nice guys, huh?
NOW STFU!
You're both losers since 1986! You, Sammy, nearly ruined a classic American rock band! And (thankfully) the only souvenir you got was a bass player.
VAN HALEN JUST KICKED YOUR ASS, AND THEY'RE GETTING READY TO KICK IT UNMERCIFULLY AGAIN!
Now, be good little boys and STFU once and for all!
The RNRHOF was a cluster fuck. Good thing there were no VH members there...
COMMENT | internet argument posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 11:20:00 AM
this is an alltime debate, DLR vs. Hagar....put it this way, if they were separate bands, if they changed their name with Hagar to Chickenfoot, CF would NOT be in the hall of fame. It is fact they were voted in for their Roth era. I'm not saying I like Roth better, but the voting committee hinted at that in ROlling Stone magazine, saying "they'd allow Hagar to come & be inducted because he was apart of the band's history"....Cherone was dismissed altogether.
Eddie Van Halen Alone was better in the DLR era, thats when he was making history. DLR VH was a Barnstorning, bombastic, classic rock band, with the tunes to melt your stereo...no, they didn't melt your girlfriend's hearts like "Dreams" or "Love walks in", and I think due to that Sam sold more?(or did he?)....the Sam era ALONE would not be HOF worthy. yes the HOF is silly concept.
Destoyer, I agree, DLR & EVH are not the men Sam & Mike are. Sam & Mike seem very cool. EVH so defensive & petty. AND, in 2009, I'd give the nod to the Sam VH being a better show(despite having to hear Dreams, how do I know when its love, that crap). Sam brings more to the table in 2009 than a admittedly washed up DLR.
get that snob Jan Wenner on the phone, he will tell you VH are in from their classic era. The Sam era was comparible to Def Lep, those types of band, that are cheesy.
COMMENT | Velvet Revolver at RRHOF.... posted by : lardo5150 7/28/2009 11:29:04 AM
COMMENT | VH albums with Roth posted by : Zoo Keeper 666 7/28/2009 11:32:54 AM
Outsold the Hagar albums 2 to 1.....
fact....
COMMENT | Lardo5150 - VR- Zookeeper posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 11:37:51 AM
VR was purposely pissing on that song. You didn't get that? They were holding strong to only playing DLR era VH, and they were told they needed to add a Sam song, so they did that & shit on it.
I love how anyone that thinks the Sam era is a bit cheesy is a "hater", and Sad. But its NOT hating to diss DLR or sad you prefer to hold your lighters up & get misty eyed to "Dreams"...you're entitled to you opinion. I say your quite soft & too sensitive Overmatik, like a Sammy Song.
Zookeeper, you said what I wanted to. That Era VH is HOF worthy cuz they were SO influential, going toe to toe with the greats, the Zeps, etc. That wasn't the case in the Sam Era, & I'm not even putting that down. Just fact. Eddie wasn't doing anything new in 1986. yes, Hagar has a technically better voice, that doesn't mean shit when it comes to writing a song...and it doesn't mean it fits a song better.
COMMENT | Classic albums posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 11:43:31 AM
VH's classic albums are all DLR era. I, II, Fairwarning, 1984(though you can sense the beginning of poppier things to come). There are no alltime classic albums from the sam era....yes, its opinion, but you won't see anyone with any credibility putting 5150 in the top 100 albums of all time...or guitar albums of alltime, again, all DLR Era....or Top 100 songs of alltime, its all DLR....this is really a silly argument the more I think of it. It elementary my dear Wolfie.
COMMENT | Roth era posted by : deflepplin 7/28/2009 11:54:37 AM
is why anybody likes Van Halen. Even if you got on board during the Sammy era, there would be nothing without all that classic music. Everybody in the world became a fan with 1984. 5150 (a good album) sold well because people were fascinated by the breakup and the band's reformation, kinda similar to a Back In Black situation.
Too bad they are all dickheads now, but I still dig the music. I can guarantee you that Van Halen's new album with Roth will kick the living shit outta Chickenpoop.
COMMENT | I love both VH posted by : overmatik 7/28/2009 12:00:51 PM
No BSlash24, you got me wrong. I also prefer Dave era over Sammy era!
The issue is that most Dave fans call Sammy all kinds of bad names, and I don't agree with that, because I respect them both. You don't see Sammy fans bashing Dave, not that much.
Van Halen was amazing and perfect. Van Hagar was good too. F.U.C.K. is an amazing album to me.
Now, putting a kid on Mike's spot and call this VH? No way. This must be referred to as Van Roth.
COMMENT | PMS!!!!! posted by : Neil Young's Cocaine Booger 7/28/2009 12:13:19 PM
Somebody should've told Diva Lee Roth and the Van Halen sisters to take a couple Midols and man-up.
Then again......they can't even get up off their asses to do new music!!!!!!!
COMMENT | DLR_EngineRoom posted by : Neil Young's Cocaine Booger 7/28/2009 12:17:32 PM
Why.......is Diva gonna swat me with his purse????? Or Eddie with his walker?????
Van Halen couldn't even kick Poison's ass, let alone our asses!!!!!
COMMENT | overmatik posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 12:30:33 PM
my apologies...and I agree, F.U.C.K is a very good album, hard rockin', and the best with Hagar...but still not an alltime classic album, that's my point. Very good album though...ou812 has some good moments too. 5150, for my $$, doesn't hold up, dripping with mid 80's production, too many sappy moments. I hate the drum sound.
Deflepplin is right though. The original band put them on the map & made them huge. They were the reason people got into them. They were HUGE! I also maintain, by 1986, Eddie VH was so huge, that you could have plugged virtually anyone in at that point & it would have been big. Not knocking Sam(in my opinion a bad choice), but it could have been Billy Squire, Billy Idol, you name it. He had the songs written(Summer night for example), it was fool proof.
COMMENT | Sam posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 1:24:49 PM
I've left the sammy bashing out...but come on, Sam is worthy of a good bash....and DLR is too, post 1988. But with VH on his first run, they were monsters. and not a sappy moment musically, no dreams taking you higher, or love walking in, all that Hallmark BS.
like it was said, its total opinion. I for one feel Sammy pre VH was as bad as it got. One of those soundtrack song writers, on a mission to destroy rock, right there with Rick Springfield, REO, .38 Special, Billy Squier. Middle of the road, corny ass rock. Not on any par with VH. Sam hit the lottery with that gig....
as far as HOF, had Sam hooked his wagon to VH, he wouldn't be in the HOF, and he'd be an 80's footnote otherwise. A Nightranger type. Your love is driving me crazy...ouch. I'm just glad now one was hurt recording that song.
COMMENT | posted by : abigllama 7/28/2009 1:29:57 PM
I worked in a shitty record store that bought and sold used CDs in '99. There were two albums were were strictly not allowed to buy anymore of because we had way too many and no one wanted to buy them. The first was Chumbawumba, the other was Van Halen 3.
COMMENT | posted by : kimidead138 7/28/2009 1:54:51 PM
RNRHOF who gives a fuck when some institute of old man gives you credit, fuck that shit. No one in their right minds should go there
They are now a greatest hits band with a teenager on bass. Nothing more.
COMMENT | Generic user 666 posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 2:16:14 PM
what you said is true, Van Halen is humanary stew. Done. for sure....not the point of the debate, but they are cooked. Saw them in 2007, it was bland. From a band that used to blow your socks off.
COMMENT | Reading this stuff is like watching liberals report on Obama - total bias. posted by : wil t 7/28/2009 3:15:45 PM
It's funny that fans of David Lee Roth are so insecure that they have to bash Sammy Hagar, and that era of Van Halen. Van Halen I has absolutely nothing to do with 1984 other than the fact that it was the same people making the music. Every album is it's own entity. I completely disagree with BSlash's assertion that 5150 is not among the top 100 best albums. It's funny that people who love "I'll Wait" and "Jump" want to bash "Dreams" and "When it's Love". That's ridiculous. All are great songs and exhibit terrific playing. Granted, Dave and Sammy write different types of songs, but for those who want to bash Sammy as writing soundtracks, I hate to tell you this, but they only use good songs, with great hooks for movies. Sammy has always written catchy songs regardless of what band or era he's been in. I like a lot of Dave's stuff as well. It's all taste.
Anyone who says that the Van Hagar era can't cut it on it's own is clueless. Every album that they did with Hagar went to number 1. Maybe that's not your definition of credibility, but it is the definition of popularity. It doesn't matter what method of production that Eddie used on 5150, or OU812, F.U.C.K, or Balance. All were different, and appropriate for each album.
Dreams, Summer Nights, Best of Both Worlds, Mine All Mine, Finish What Ya Started, Cabo Wabo, Poundcake, Judgement Day, Runaround, The Dream is Over, Right Now, Top of the World, The Seventh Seal, Can't Stop Lovin' You, Don't Tell Me, Amsterdam, Aftershock & Humans Being are all classics on rock radio, and have nothing to do with David Lee Roth, nor could he have sang any of them. Hagar, very easily sang all of Roth's songs.
Nothing that the Hagar era did could take away from Roth's era, and vice versa.
COMMENT | Both eras posted by : lardo5150 7/28/2009 3:29:56 PM
I see so much of this on the links.
I am a die hard van halen fan. A fan of BOTH Eras. in fact, this is the only time I will ever refer to Van Halen in eras. I just see it as one period. FYI also, Eddie has stated in MANY interviews that he writes all the music and Sammy comes in and adds some melodies, just as Dave did. Everyone blames Sammy or bashes Dave......Blame Ed.
Sorry guys, I do like Hagar's solo work. I also like Dave's.
VH 3 = Bizzaro World. To bad to, Gary had a great stage presence and an awesome voice. Like I said before, blame Eddie.
I made a comment above about VR doing Round n Round at the HOF, and someone said they botched it on purpose because they did not want to play any Hagar era material. If thats true, then VR needs to be bashed even more. Regardless on how you feel, Van Halen, BOTH PERIODS, was there to be honored. If you get picked to perform some songs, then do it right.
Dave vs Sammy arguments are about as pointless as watching paint dry. Who cares. Enjoy the music.
COMMENT | One more post... posted by : wil t 7/28/2009 3:36:48 PM
I concur with lardo5150! I did like VR, but I couldn't understand how bad they sounded. If that's the case, then it's ridiculous, and they got what they deserved didn't they?
COMMENT | Personally, posted by : Lorn 7/28/2009 3:38:36 PM
I like both Roth and Hagar time periods, but I enjoy watching Sammy footage and concerts of Van Halen more, simply for the fact that though Roth may be a really great showman, Hagar is a good musician with a real positive attitude. Its great watching him sing and play guitar, exchange jams with Eddie, etc.
I just think of Sammy as more of a musician than Roth. His own band before Halen was cool, and he has been was quite successful solo since Halen. I mean, Sammy is not the end all or be all of guitar players, but he can hold his own and if you look back at some of that old footage (which I have) there is some great stuff there he cranked out. You really can see the talent.
So, I just don't like to compare the to time periods of Halen. Roth era Halen was really fucking rockin. Hagar was more pop sure, but capture the imagination in a certain way at a certain time period (I remember those days, do you?). They are almost like two totally different bands. I don't see any reason to even compare them really.
COMMENT | my take posted by : mcman71 7/28/2009 3:42:05 PM
wil t- can we PLEASE keep the politics out of this thread? Whether you're a DEM, REP, Communist or what the fuck has nothing to do with this argument. Wait until uncle Ted shoots his mouth off again why don't you?
Personally, I would just love it if Mike and Sam just came out and told the truth. THEY fired Ed and Alex. In 2009, Joe and Chad are upgrades, plain and simple.
I'm not taking anything away from Roth era VH. It was great music. No one played that way before them. But to say that Van Hagar wasn't just as influential? You may not like any of these bands, but every corporate rock band that has put out a record since 1997 owes a major debt to either solo Sammy or Van Hagar. Chad Kroeger's vocals are complete Sammy rip off's. Same with Three Days Grace, Hinder, Daughtry, Theory of A Deadman and on and on.
Oh, and the fact that more chicks dug the Van Hagar stuff? Even better.
COMMENT | Eddie, Alex and Dave were posted by : boomboom! 7/28/2009 3:56:05 PM
The CLASS ACT that night. They stayed home so the two GLORY HOG'S could have a moment. Ed, Al and Dave proved a point that night (by staying home)on who the REAL TALENT was and who were really responsible for getting this band into the Hall of Fame. Go listen to The two GLORY HOG'S performance on youtube!! NOT HOF MATERIAL AT ALL(let's see if Chickenfoot makes it in in 25 years)
AS far as the Sam getting Van Halen into the HOF. They were eligible in 2004. They were overlooked UNTIL SAMMY LEFT AND DAVE JOINED IN 2007! Then the Hall came knocking and The Brother's smartly GAVE THE HALL THE FINGER!!!!
COMMENT | wil t posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 4:03:12 PM
fans of the original VH, and more of the music and EDDIE as opposed to Roth, don't CARE how many #1's. who cares. Mariah Carey has a shit load of #1s. That actually just tells me they are a pop band....I'm sure Aerosmith post 1988 have more #1s than 70's Aerosmith, but I certainly would rather listen to the 70's despite the lack of #1's. lame.
I'll wait & Jump, I'll give you. As I mentioned in another post, 1984 had the beginnings of going poppier. Those 2 songs are my least fav. of that era. Add Panama & H4teacher to that as well....but the rest, there's no sell out. Vhagar was 100% into selling singles....5150 sucks.
RE: Sammy pre VH, if you're backing that as good rock, then whats the point of debating. Soundtrack rock. I'm sure you like Kenny Loggins & solo Glen Frey(the Heat is on baby!)....you're love is driving me crazy. I'll fall in love again. God, its horrible. I can't drive 55! weeee! Right there with "We built this city on R&R". that lyric alone is so gay.
RE: VR, as I said they PURPOSELY tried to fuck up Round & Round. they just muttered round & round, never singing a verse. They said it in interview, they only wanted to pay tribute to DLR era, they weren't as much fans of the Sam era.
they were 2 different bands. And as a big fan of the 1st band, it was sad to see that band get reduced to a pile of pop shit...though as I mentioned, I'll give them F.U.C.K, which had some edge. Sammy's voice, while technically better for sure, is so damn annoying to boot....he's a complete rock hack...better musician than roth, I don't know, cuz he can play decent guitar? he can't write a song though to save his life(the good VH ones are Eddie) and the worst, hands down, worse than paul Stanley's, lyrics in the history of a famous rock band, ATROCIOUS. I'm not comparing to Roth, I'm comparing to everyone!! There, I said it!
COMMENT | great posted by : creedence 7/28/2009 4:26:05 PM
all of this doesn't really matter, as EVH will get lung cancer from smoking 3 packs a day. Anyone see that video of him talking about his new signature guitar? He looks like he's 75 years old.
COMMENT | posted by : paulster9072 7/28/2009 4:37:16 PM
Ive always been on the DLR/VH side of things, but I have been worried that if they ever finally get around to making anything new, which apparently is still a couple years away, that its going to be a disappointment based on alot of the stuff Roth has done in the last few years (except the DLR band cd which was superior to all Hagar era VH)and all the reports that eddie cant play as well anymore.Besides, The longer you have to wait for a cd, the more you build up your expectations and chances that you will be disappointed by the end result.Can Anyone say "Chinese democracy"?
Having listened to Chickenfoot's Cd, Id say the bar is set pretty high.I dont know if Van Halen can pull off a cd as good right now, because with the exception of a couple stupid attempts at grunge (which I always hate classic rock bands attempts at grunge) its a great cd.
It makes me wonder who was really at fault for all the crappy radio pop VH made with Hagar in the 80's and early 90's.I always balmed Hagar because thats when it got really bad, but maybe it would have been the same if Dave had still been singing in that time period?!?!?
COMMENT | Paulster posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 4:47:41 PM
you may be right. I blame Hagar for dreams(well those hokie lyrics are his), but VH was heading in a more pop direction. And EVH wrote the music. Though he said he had Dreams before & Roth rejected, and he couldn't hit the high note. (that a good thing, I hate that singing!!)....I personally think most bands have 5-7 great years, 5-7 albums. VH might have peak. another good album or 2...even Eddies sound on 5150 got lighter, he didn't break any new ground after that either, not Sam's fault...but it is another reason I like the first era VH, for EVH, forget sam & DLR.
any new VH will disappoint. I know i sound negative, but rock history tells us this. Roth can't sing like that anymore. They were tired live, & they will be in the studio too, they are now in their late 50's.
COMMENT | for BSlash24, re: Hagar/Roth posted by : kirneh001 7/28/2009 5:00:02 PM
I can agree that the original recording lineup was a great band. But I also think that the Hagar and Cherone lineups were great bands too (even tho the VH3 album tanked).
I can't say anything about the new DLR/Wolfie lineup (beyond the *terrible* performance of Eruption that was posted on Youtube when Wolfie was first drafted in by his dad), because the new lineup hasn't released anything official yet.
It goes to what sounds good and what feels good at the time. I hope we can agree on that, at least :)
Henrik
COMMENT | Damn... posted by : Raiders757 7/28/2009 5:51:52 PM
...it's a shame for the recording industry when "biggest accolade" is used to describe being inducted into an extremely lame tourist attraction in the city of Cleveland Ohio.
COMMENT | van halen 3 the best ever posted by : wizz 7/28/2009 6:42:19 PM
i know good music when i hear it and that was the van halen that rocked the best with gary rock on !
COMMENT | BSlash24 posted by : sgt.hartman 7/28/2009 6:51:01 PM
First, howzit, man? I really would like to know where Velvet Revolver admitted in an interview that they intentionally botched the Hagar era VH song at the RRHOF induction. I find that very hard to believe considering how good of friends those guys are with Hagar. Slash played on Sammy's Marching to Mars album, (his first after the split with VH). Matt Sorum played drums on Sammy's recent single "Loud" and appears in the video. Duff is on the radio a lot out here in Seattle and I remember him talking about how he knows Sammy because he's hung out with him at Cabo Wabo over the years. These guys have been tight for years. I don't see them botching his music just to make a statement when they are such good friends. Makes no sense at all.
As you know, I love both versions of VH. I agree that the Roth era was harder rocking. But I do not agree that VH got into the RRHOF solely because of the Roth era. First, how hard you rock has nothing to do with whether you get in (REM?, Patti Smith?, etc.). We'll never know if VH would have ever been inducted solely on the Roth years because by the time they were eligible, Hagar had already been in the band and they remained hugely popular.
I do believe that VH doesn't get into the Hall with solely Hagar only because they established themselves with Roth so he had to be part of the deal. We'll never really know what would have happened if Roth had never been in the band.
But to argue they would have gotten in without the Hagar era by citing to a quote that "Hagar was included only because he was part of the history of the band" doesn't fly. By that rationale, Gary Cherone should also have been there because he was a part of the band's history. As much as the Hagar haters want to discount his era of VH, you just can't when it comes to arguing why they got in to the Hall of Fame. Personal musical taste clearly is not the controlling factor for entry - consider many of the acts that have been inducted. And it doesn't even matter which VH era rocked harder or sold more records, had more #1s or was more popular, etc. The fact is, both versions of the band were hugely popular. Both singers were a key part of the band's overall success.
I also noticed you again brought up and trashed Sammy's pre-VH solo career and remake the Billy Squire, 38 special comparisons, etc. to make the point that Sammy would never have been inducted into the RRHOF without having been a part of VH. True statement but so what? Roth would never have been inducted without having been in VH either. The difference is Roth made a name for himself in VH. Whether you like the music or not, Hagar made a name for himself on his own.
Not sniping here, just regular discourse as we've enjoyed in the past. I pick on you only because I enjoy your posts. Even if I don't agree, at least they are intelligent. I just can't bring myself to argue with someone like boomboom who slams Mike and Sam as glory hounds for attending their own induction ceremony and applauds the VH bros and Dave for skipping it.
COMMENT | From my perspective... posted by : kplittledreamer 7/28/2009 6:51:39 PM
Eddie was in rehab when the induction happened. You rarely hear anything out of Alex except for the occasional drum magazine interview. He pretty much does his own thing and gets together with Eddie to jam. With that being said, I completely understand why Roth wasn't there. Does anyone really think he wanted to go up on stage without the brothers and have to stand there with two guys who aren't in the band anymore? Putting myself in Roth's shoes, I can see how that would be really awkward. The point is Van Halen is in the Hall Of Fame for their influence on hard rock and heavy metal. That's it. Their entire career has been one big party and that's why I've been a huge fan. I don't think there is a band that came after them that was not influenced by them directly or indirectly. That makes them one of the pillars of rock 'n' roll. That's all I have to say. Time to throw out the brown m and m's and eat the rest. Peace.
I agree with you. But I think the reason why it was going to be awkward for Roth was that his ego wouldn't let him sing on the same stage as Sammy because, as he learned on the Sans Halen tour, Sammy's pipes have held up so much better than his. So he came up with the excuse that he won't come since they won't let me do "Jump" (which sounds silly to me when you consider how many other great songs he had with VH and that he was very anti-Jump when they wrote it because of the keyboards).
And before the Roth contingent starts calling me names, understand that I'm only saying Hagar had the better voice, I'm not voicing a preference for either frontman of the band or bashing Roth.
COMMENT | Addendum to my last post ^^^^ posted by : sgt.hartman 7/28/2009 7:12:38 PM
The truly ironic thing about Roth not wanting to be compared to Hagar on stage is that Hagar sounded horrible at the RRHOF.
Here's the saddest part of how the VH induction went down... imagine if all the members were there. And imagine if they all got up on stage together with Roth and Hagar singing one of each of their songs together, taking turns with the verses. The peace could have been made in a single night and all of the historical BS and hard feelings and harsh words put to rest forever.
And who knows, maybe we'd all quit bashing each other about VH on this website?
NAH... never happen.
COMMENT | Sgt. posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 7:28:31 PM
HOw are you in Seattle?....I will dig that interview up re: VR. It was either Slash or Scott tha mentioned they were only interested in doing a DLR era song....then DLR said he'd participate if VR played Jump, which they refused to....then they said "well do (they listed the songs) such & such songs". THey were all DLR era songs they agreed to do, because they didn't feel comfortable doing others...the HOF committee said they needed to add a hagar song, which they reluctantly did, because the band wasn't that familiar or into that era. It wasn't really a diss, but in the interview, they made it clear they weren't into the Hagar VH.
I'll find it & I'm not stating that to make a point against Hagar. AS you can see by their performance, they try to replicate "aint talking about love" and they are surely better than what they did on Round & Round. THey are goofing on it. whether cuz they don't want to play it, but obviously the didnt' learn it & Give about 5% effort.
Slash may get along with Hagar, but he's stating he stopped liking VH after Fairwarning. Granted, that was from old interviews.
COMMENT | McMan71 posted by : wil t 7/28/2009 11:11:14 PM
McMan71 - The last time I checked this is a free country, and I'll name my comments whatever I want to, so there ya go jackass.
Ironically, our thoughts on Sammy's time in the band were similar.
BSlash - to even attempt to compare Sammy Hagar to Rick Springfield, Kenny Logins, etc is ridiculous. It sounds like if someone writes a catchy song, it's schlock - as long as it's not an artist that you endorse. Obviously, it's just taste. I just find it hypocritical no one is calling "Jump" schlock.
By the way, "I'll Wait" and "Jump" were great songs...not just "Mean Streets" & "Runnin' With the Devil".
COMMENT | Wil T posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 11:50:40 PM
ah, but comparing Sammy to Rick Springfield is NOT ridicules, seeing Sammy WROTE the Springfield song "you're love is driving me crazy". I gotcha there...I set you up maybe, even! But it true....listen, completely your tastes, they are as valid as mine, I state my opinion maybe too strongly, but sammy DID write that sort of shlock. I can't drive 55?! Come on. that's as goofy as rock gets. It is taste, but there's good & bad taste! ha! I'm kidding...Sammy wrote TONS of soundtrack rock in the early 80's, which I find to be rubbish. the WHole "heavy metal" sound track or "fast times". Its middle of the road rock. Sammy was RIGHT there in the middle...and I think had he not been in VH, we'd talk about him like we do say the band "Quarterflash" or Big Country...I think the comparison to Billy Squire is dead on. No? He was big in 1983.
and no, writing a Good, solid catchy tune, ala the Beatles, not schlock...but that's the hard part, writing a catchy tune without selling out. without being Cheesy. Desmond CHild is an example of complete shit writing....Aerosmith did it in the 70's but failed in the 90's....I disagree on I'll wait. Its too dated. Its not a sell out, but my least fav. DLR Era song.
Sgt Hartman, 90's & Humid in Boston. Heat wave.
BTW, had a friend over, in these posts we discussed F.U.C.K as being solid....after listen for the first time in probably 10 years, it just doesn't hold up. THe production is terrible, very dated. A hard rock song like Judgement Day, is so reverby, echoy, the drums so tinny, it kills the warm power Eddie used to have. And he does those "horsey" whammy sounds, its not a good sound. He sounds like the guys that ripped him off....then we threw on VHII...forget Sam & DLR, really, Eddie has the best sound on that, its recorded the way a record should be, Classically. I just dont' even hear any comparison, that era EDDIE blows EDDIE away in 1986-1991. Can people not hear that?...and there really isn't too much cheesy writing on FUCK other than Right now & Top of the world.
BUT, you all aren't jackasses for thinking differently, I enjoy the debate.
COMMENT | PS posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 11:54:51 PM
we can all agree, the R&R HOF is a silly concept that is also very snobby, and leaves very worthy bands out, and a lot of not worth in. That's a whole other debate.
COMMENT | VHIII posted by : BSlash24 7/28/2009 11:59:35 PM
I might be the only one on the planet that likes VHIII, not a big fan of Cherones vocals, very Hagarish at times, but there is no pop shit. THey are very creative on this album, pushing the envelope, not playing it safe at all! I respect that. They might miss the mark a bit, but I'd rather miss the mark being "odd" than missing the mark with "cuz that's what dreams are made of"....but I can definitely hear the A&R man saying "I don't hear a single".
COMMENT | bslash posted by : sgt.hartman 7/29/2009 2:40:50 AM
hot out there too huh? I'm wondering if it's too hot if you are calling the song ,"Heavy Metal" 80s schlock rock. Please. I'll grant you Hagar put out some cheesy tunes pre-VH but Heavy Metal is definitely not one of them. That song brings it every bit as much as VH with Roth did.
Also can't say I agree with your assessment of Eddie's playing on F.U.C.K. vs. VH II. He's way more polished during F.U.C.K. but perhaps the rawer sound is what you prefer.
Stay cool.
COMMENT | Sgt. hartman posted by : BSlash24 7/29/2009 9:44:04 AM
its definitely opinion & preference....FairWarning is more polished, layered guitars but meatier, for my tastes....
I was watching clips from VH at US festival yesterday, even there I can see a regression in EVH's playing. He was starting to become a parady of himself, it wasn't as tasteful, and I can note "romeo delight", he taps, & taps, & taps, so unnecessarily, in every fill, it sounds cheesy. He didn't do that early on, like say the clip of them doing "you're no good" from 1979. Which is at their height of powers, which lasted til 1981...
I used to think EVH was the end all, but in hind sight, I think he stopped really being innovative after FairWarning. not to say he didn't have some big moments, but guitar wise, guitar sound, it was down hill from there....during the Hagar years, the raw edge was gone....BUT, you can say the same of every big band, player. They have their peaks. Of course too, you can disagree!
COMMENT | oh-Heavy Metal posted by : BSlash24 7/29/2009 10:17:58 AM
Sgt Hartman, I'm going to piss off every Sam fan....let me say this, as a person, in interview, while he can be a bit goofy at times, Sammy seems like a straight shooting, down to earth guy, that I'm sure respects his fans. I'd rather have a beer with him & Mike A over DLR & EVH at this point.
but, the song "heavy metal", while not sappy like "i'll fall in love again", to me, is more middle of the road, save, no edged, pseudo "hard" rock, like a song like "rockin' into the night" by .38 special. Or Billy Squier. I'd turn it if I heard it....not that I do, its a lost track, lost in 1981. It reminds me of like Bryan Adams, all those guys that were on a mission to destroy rock. Extremely corporate, trying to "rock"....I guess if I ever run into you in Seattle, we'll have to play VH II on the juke box! or F.U.C.K.
COMMENT | surfin'w nuts posted by : BSlash24 7/29/2009 10:50:06 AM
excuse my ignorance, where's Tejas?....you were taking in the rock scene in the early 80s? What is your take on the pre VH Sammy? Did you enjoy his hits?...where would his standing be in rock history, had he said to eddie, "naw, not into being in VH". Would he have held his own, faired better than his 80's contempories? What is your take.
And, if VH started with 5150, would this be a band considered for R&R HOF? Would the big hits of Right now, Love walks in, Dreams, propel them to that notoriety?....anyone else?
This debate, Hagar, Roth, is as an important debate as humans can take on. Remain in war or pull out? Prof Gates right, or the officer?...important issues, but they don't hold a candle to Hagar/Roth!
COMMENT | Eddie was right posted by : vivazappa 7/29/2009 11:04:50 AM
The Van Halen Roth era got them into the HOF.
Sammy should be in for all the great music he's made. Montrose, VH, the solo stuff early with Bill Church and even the Waboritos.. Don'tget me wrong the Waboritos certainly don't belong in the hall but Sammy's over all work does.
Sammy's show in 84 was the loudest show I've ever seen.
VH's Fair Warning tour had Dave at the top of his game.
The only Sammy record with VH that I don't like is "Balance" the only Roth era dislike is "1984".
That said Eddie, Alex and Dave were right. Sammy and Mike should have skipped it too...Let's face it...
THE ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME SUCKS!!!!
COMMENT | VR posted by : BSlash24 7/29/2009 12:42:32 PM
Sgt H, I looked through the internet for the interview, found scott weiland, he said Roth would only perform if they did Jump, but VR wasn't comfortable with that cuz they don't have keyboards, they planned on Jaime's Cryin', Aint talkin' bout love or you really got me....and the adlibbed RunAround, because they had issues finding a suitable Sammy era song, so they did a "punked out version"....
I did read Slash making a simular sort of "putdown" when it was mentioned Sammy didn't think a guy like Slash should have attempted Eddie....though he played Aint talking bout love note for note....they were most definitely just going through the motions, at best, on RunAround. I think they were trashing it, just watch & hear the performanace. They are much better than that! No?
COMMENT | Follow Up to BSlash... posted by : wil t 7/29/2009 1:51:24 PM
I'll AGREE with you...I'm the only other person on the planet who liked VHIII....I didn't try to compare it to Dave or Sam. The overall problem with the album is that Eddie and Mike Post wanted Gary Cherone to sing like Sammy Hagar, and his voice is just not that strong. There was some great music on that album (i.e, Without You, Once, Dirty Water Dog, Josephina. How Many Say I would have been very cool had Eddie not tried to sing those harmonies with Gary).
Back to Hagar....his work with Montrose deserves a lot of credit...and BSlash....Sammy wrote nothing for Rick Springfield. Springfield covered Hagar's song (I've done everything for you). Hagar produced MANY more hits during that 80's era than Kenny Loggins, Springfield, etc., so that's not a valid comparison.
You're absolutely right, it is about taste, and your perspective is completely valid. I get pissed when people attempt to dismiss Sammy's legacy as opposed to Roth. That's when you see people like myself stand up and say wait a minute. When you can't acknowledge that either Dave or Sammy did something great because you are a blind follower incapable of any type of analysis (i.e., DLR Machine), that's when you have no credibility.
I will also say Sammy's first post VH album, "Marching to Mars" is outstanding as well.
Let me also say to demonstrate my credibility that Sammy's songwriting has been ridiculously bad on his last solo album - maybe 5 decent songs on the whole thing, and on this album w/ Chickenfoot. His singing is dead on, but the vocals just sucked completely. That is what's missing from the CF album.
As per your discussion with sgt.hartman, I'm glad you said:
"I guess if I ever run into you in Seattle, we'll have to play VH II on the juke box! or F.U.C.K."
and not:
"I guess if I ever run into you in Seattle, we'll have to play VH II on the juke box or FUCK.."
Whew!
COMMENT | bslash/wilt posted by : sgt.hartman 7/29/2009 2:35:31 PM
Wil t - "his singing in dead on but the vocals sucked completely." I'm confused. Do you mean the lyrics sucked? I think Sam sounds great on CF but will concede a lot of the lyrics are less than good.
bslash - no debate from me that VR sucked on Runaround - if you can call it that. But as great as Slash is, Sam may have had a point about perhaps he shouldn't have tried to play eddie. His intro into ATBL was pretty painful to listen to as well.
The only point I was trying to make earlier is that Roth is no different than Sammy in terms of only being in the RRHOF because of VH.
Although I think Sam put out some great music pre and post VH (and some bad music), I don't think he would get in to the RRHOF on his own merits. The same is true of Roth. There's no way Roth gets in based on his solo music. I'd venture to say that if Roth was a nobody when he put out his solo work, he'd remain a nobody. His solo work sold because people loved his work in VH and he'd already become this popular frontman. So both artists needed VH to get in to the fame. But I don't think both artists needed VH to become successful. There I have to give the nod to Hagar, who made it on his own. Like I've said though, I love both versions of VH but it's one band. There really is no debate for me. I think Roth is the more entertaining frontman but Hagar is the more talented musician and both versions put out great music.
I'm glad we can have this immensely important roth/sam debate with pleasant overtones. Each day we progress as men! I find it imperative I take a break in my work day to comment further on this Grand Issue. So many hard breaking points, counterpoints. The world news could cover this topic daily & it would never tire. Brilliant posts, from visionaries.
Wil T - Ballet and the Bullet, the intro is some of Ed's coolest work in years. Its an odd release, the whole album. I semi dig it.
Hagar wrote/was covered by Springfield, you're splitting hairs. The Hagar version is equally rock light, no? Those cheesy 80's keyboards...I will not back down on the fact Sammy's solo work Pre VH is just bastardization of Rock. it is the definition of...Schlock. The sappy songs, and the faux rockers. I mocked him in the day, along with Squier. And at the time he had no affiliation with VH. Bryan Adams, all that soundtrack light Pop/rock. I just can do it, or see any value in it.
So, with that, I would have to dismiss Sammy's legacy, and I back it up with this. No VH, Sammy is an 80's footnote in rock history. Do you think he'd be big today? He has interest in the Waboritos cuz of his VH past....his contempories in the 80's are all gone. the Squiers, the Nightrangers. he was on that Par.
Had billy Squier been in VH after Roth, he'd have a career now. He'd have sung the same 5150 songs & he'd be considered a "rocker"....sammy is one of rock's luckiest MFers ever. He was middle of the road at best pre VH...Montrose, come on. I hear that argument all the time. again, BASE, boring, middle of the road, unimaginative, overrated rock....there's a reason they are a complete footnote in rock history. Rock Candy, Bad Motorscooter, those song....well, its opinion again. I wouldn't go into an argument FOR sammy using Montrose, the same I wouldn't use ROth's "Filthly little Mouth" as one for him.
No, Roth didnt' have a stellar solo career either, but he used up his prime years as the biggest front man in VH. He was a piece of the puzzle, he helped propel VH to bigger heights. He's no super talent. he had some balls up to 1981...then he got pretty silly as well....he's a utter washup now. Complete & total.
sgt. you are right about roth, people bought his solo stuff cuz VH, of course, though his first solo record is quite good, for that flash type metal....as far as Sam being a better musician, I guess cuz he plays guitar better? I don't think sam could write a song to save his life though, and that's part of being a musician. Opinion again. I can say, without trying to put Sam down, or "win" an argument, I don't like one, not one of his solo songs. "There's only one way to rock" is ok at best, VH's treatment of it rocked a bit more. Again, just block head, Jr. High, no imagination lyrics again. That's Sam to the core. that song Red comes to mind too.
Tell me a deep Sam song that might really rock me? Just one. I'll listen. (non VH).
COMMENT | PS posted by : BSlash24 7/29/2009 3:54:00 PM
I'll have t watch again, but I thought Slash played ATBLove intro note for note.
fantastic points....Sam btw, is damn hard working. Great business man. Into what he does, looks great for 61. he gives 110%. I respect that. I like some of his VH work. I wasn't pleased when I found out he was the choice.
You must have been getting into rock around the Tejas Jam!...I should have caught tejas was Texas.
Re: Schon, I can not believe the career resurgence Journey has found, with a replacement singer. They are luckier than Sam. AGain, not much of a fan, super talented, but the talents used for evil.
Sam'sleftnut says "YES" to VanHagar alone, in the R&R HOF. So you are very open minded.
COMMENT | surfin' with nuts posted by : BSlash24 7/29/2009 4:47:49 PM
what school in Boston? see any shows back in the day in Boston?
I can't say Dave is a better musician than Sam, but Dave I bet had far more input than realized, a lot of influence on the direction of the music. I've read he could be militant about a songs direction...of course we all know he rejected Jump around W&CH First, And Dreams on 1984...Dave has/had a great sense of how to rock n roll. And a great showman...till he bought into his hype around 82, you can see he just wants to goof off on stage at that point. "I forgot the fuckin' lyrics maaaan". Funny to a point....Sam was indeed a pro. Hard working background.
one of the best Sam/vH songs I've heard, & only heard it once or twice, was the throw in on their 2 CD great hits, those new songs, one of them was very heavy, rockin'.
COMMENT | Sammy songs posted by : wil t 7/29/2009 5:24:19 PM
BSlash - here are some of the songs that I'll hang my hat on any day:
-"Eagles' Fly" acoustic or w/ VH -"One Way to Rock" - sounds better w/ VH - "Little White Lie" - "Salvation on Sand Hill" -"On the Other Hand" - "Both Sides Now" - "Marching to Mars" - "Three Lock Box" - "Heavy Metal" - "55" - that was a pretty cool concept - if the speed limit were still 55 it would be even more pertinent. - "Serious Ju Ju" - "3 in the Middle" - "The Real Deal" - "Sam I am" - great lyrics and great guitar playing
No one knows where Sammy would've gone had he not joined VH. VOA was his best selling album at the time, so his career was definitely on the upswing.
I still reject the notion that his songs were schlock. He wasn't reinventing the wheel certainly, but they were rock and roll songs w/ great hooks. The point is to write songs that people will like, and over the years, he certainly has accomplished that.
COMMENT | Sammy songs posted by : wil t 7/29/2009 5:24:21 PM
BSlash - here are some of the songs that I'll hang my hat on any day:
-"Eagles' Fly" acoustic or w/ VH -"One Way to Rock" - sounds better w/ VH - "Little White Lie" - "Salvation on Sand Hill" -"On the Other Hand" - "Both Sides Now" - "Marching to Mars" - "Three Lock Box" - "Heavy Metal" - "55" - that was a pretty cool concept - if the speed limit were still 55 it would be even more pertinent. - "Serious Ju Ju" - "3 in the Middle" - "The Real Deal" - "Sam I am" - great lyrics and great guitar playing
No one knows where Sammy would've gone had he not joined VH. VOA was his best selling album at the time, so his career was definitely on the upswing.
I still reject the notion that his songs were schlock. He wasn't reinventing the wheel certainly, but they were rock and roll songs w/ great hooks. The point is to write songs that people will like, and over the years, he certainly has accomplished that.
COMMENT | bslash posted by : sgt.hartman 7/29/2009 5:26:54 PM
"Roth used up his prime years as the biggest frontman in VH." That's my point. That's why they were his prime years - because he was in VH. Just like Sam's prime years were when he was in VH.
And you ask for a "deep" Sam song that will really rock you. "Deep" is kind of an unfair qualification when we are comparing Sam to Roth in VH. Sure VH with Roth rocked you, but there's nothing "deep" about the music.
But if you want "deep" songs by Sam that will rock you, I suggest you check out his Marching to Mars album. Specifically, "Salvation on Sand Hill" and "Leaving the Warmth of the Womb."
COMMENT | Amen Sgt.hartman posted by : wil t 7/29/2009 5:47:22 PM
I can not disagree with a single point....and that's hard for me to accept. :)
COMMENT | I don't know man posted by : sgt.hartman 7/29/2009 8:34:18 PM
I agree VH songs aren't about depth but I don't necessarily agree that Dave's are any better or smarter on the whole. Each singer wrote some good lyrics and each wrote some pretty bad ones.
Compare "Everybody Wants Some" or "Somebody Get Me a Doctor" to "The Seventh Sign" or "Mine all Mine" and Hagar wins by landslide. Conversely, compare "Romeo Delight" or "Mean Street" to "Get Up" or "Love Walks In" and Roth wins by a landslide.
I'd be willing to bet that if you wrote the lyrics to all of the Roth songs and all of the Hagar songs and gave them to someone who didn't know anything about VH, they'd either say they don't see a difference in quality (across the board) or would possibly give the edge to Hagar. I think it's an inherent bias in those who prefer Roth to Hagar to just say the lyrics are better without giving it much thought.
COMMENT | The Hater Never Quits ???? posted by : crazy5150 7/29/2009 11:59:46 PM
If the hall of fame was dedicating the award to just the Roth years or if that was the only reason, your wrong. The induction video showed both sides of Van Halen the reason they were inducted and they asked Sammy and Mike to be a part of it because they were a part of the bands success. Keep on Hating, you miserable bastard. The VH bro.s and Dave don't care about the fans, period and the last tour was for the money, period.
COMMENT | Sammy's Gay Left Nut... posted by : sgt.hartman 7/30/2009 12:32:01 AM
I'm tempted to say your name proves my point about inherent bias toward lyrics based on personal preference of VH singer but I won't. You seem a reasonable guy.
But let me point out one thing you did say that I think absolutely proves my point. You said Everybody Wants Some and Bottoms Up are about swagger. I agree with that statement completely. But only because of the delivery and the fact Roth had more swagger than Hagar did. As far as the lyrics themselves, as just words written on a page, I don't agree. The lyrics standing alone don't have swagger. In fact, if you read them without any music playing, it's easy to see Sammy singing those very same lines.
"You got Allah in the East. You got Jesus in the West. Christ! What's a man to do?" I think that's a pretty fucking great lyric when you consider the context of the song - search for truth, the silliness of organized religion telling you what's what etc. It's clever. It's ironic. And it conveys the confusion of someone trying to find real truth through all the stuff being touted by various religions.
Sorry, but as a lyric I'll take that over "Everybody wants some. I want some too. Everybody wants some. How bout you?"
Face it, if Sammy wrote those words, you and Bslash would be critical of them simply because you prefer Dave.
It's all good though. We all like who we like. I just want to be push people to really be honest about why they dislike Sammy. Yeah, he's written some rubbish lyrics in his time. But I think objectively, no more than Dave and that if it's Dave you prefer, it's probably not on the basis of lyrics. It's his delivery and the attitude perhaps. Which is reasonable.
COMMENT | Deep posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 9:04:54 AM
I meant a deep cut. Not mentally deep, or musically deep. I know Sam doesn't go there. Deep for Sam would be "cabo wabo"...and that's all Ed.
COMMENT | Sgt Hartment & Hagarittos posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 9:25:41 AM
we're never going to see eye to eye on this. I'm reading your posts, & there's a quality to Roth's lyrics that I feel you're missing. Everybody wants some is genius. Its bizzarro world Roth, sex, drugs, r&R served up Diamond Dave style. You can't get romantic on a subway line, "Conductor don't like it, says, "You're wastin' your time" I took a mobile light, lookin' for a moonbeam. Ow! Yeah, ya stand in line ya got lost in a jet stream"...then the whole "I like the way the line runs up the back of the stocking...alltime classic rock ad lib. Very rememberable.
its crotch grabbing, raunch & roll lyrics, non sensical, perfection I think. he's not trying to rhyme Red with Bed, that's what I said, or writing "that what dreams are made of", or maybe the alltime worst, goofy lyric in rock history, this side of "We built this city on R&R"..."I can't drive 55". I get douche chills hearing that lyric...'there's only one way to rock", goofy lyric, like "I'm rockin', yeah, rockin' through the night, we'll help you rock your town, we're gonna party down"...shit.
But I guess we see it different. you might find inspiration from "we'll get higher & higher, who knows what we'll find", and I want to get sick...and you see lazy, stupid & dumb in "everybody wants some", I hear balls, swagger, humor, brilliant simplicisty...no, not Bob Dylan, or any of the great lyricist, but rock & roll, party rock lyrics with lots of humor, and not just typical "we rock, there's only one way to rock, Rockin' all night"...any fool can write that. GENERIC!!...that's the word that perfectly describes Sam.
Sam is Generic. There, I said it. That sums it up. He's not horrible, he can sing, he gives it all, he tries to rock, he's just flat out, 100% Generic. Be it the rock n roll sentiment, or his sappy hallmark love songs....maybe Ace Frehley has worse lyrics.
Roth kept it a party, simple, but humorous, more creative(with maybe Running with the devil being more generic lyric).
COMMENT | Surfin' with Sam & Nuts posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 9:30:39 AM
Bezerkly, nice! I was right near there last night(at Fenway). I too am a UMass Alum(Amherst)...ok, I won't bore -y'all.
Sgt, its a great debate, and its nothing personal. Some good examples you gave as well...7th Sign from Balance? that's the only VH record I never bought. I'm not familiar. I honestly had grown tired of Eddie's playing by that point. I found he became a parody of himself.
COMMENT | Parody posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 11:58:22 AM
wow, parody after VHII, that's bold! I think he was still growing, being innovative through Fairwarning...though a good portion of their material was written through Fairwarning, I have a Bootleg with House of Pain, Voodoo Queen(Mean Street lick), another song with the Mean Street Solo, Hang em high(was called "where were you last night), all written pre VHI...BUT, I do feel he was still growing up to that point.
After watching that US Festival the other night, his playing was out of control on it. Those 1981 Fairwarning tour clips are great, but by 1983, he was a tapping fool. Very distasteful, too fast for the sake of being fast, I feel he feel into that trap of hearing his critics just loving him, and he became a parody...by 5150, IMO, he'd had his say. Some good songs to come, but guitarwise, he'd said it all....that's one man's opinion with 25 years hind sight.
COMMENT | well said posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 2:16:58 PM
I agree completely, US Festival is still good, they are wild, definitely drunk,a bit sloppy(that never bothers me, its R&R), and its still a good rock show. From the technical standpoint, I just noticed that he's just noodling & noodling. If I had seen that in 1983, I would have loved it. Now, I'm not as impressed with that. Its not the true essense of guitar playing, as a matter of fact, if you can tap well, doing tap fills are easier than doing a tasty fill....and Ed can & does do tasty fills, he's far more that just tapping. BUt at this show he over indulges, BUT, a great show anyhow, very electric.
Where he definitely becomes a parody of himself is like the solo in Dreams, Harmonic and hit whammy on the harmonic, make horsey noise, then end it tapping. Its very lazy, cheesy, & untasteful. of course in 1986 I was eating it up. I guess my palate or understand of solid guitar work has matured...that type of solo is what all his clones were doing...and after Beat it, every Pop or R&B band had to have a fake Eddie solo. It got so lame.
COMMENT | bSlash/Sammy's Gay Left Nuts posted by : sgt.hartman 7/30/2009 2:28:11 PM
C'mon BSlash - don't say we'll never agree. That makes me feel like there's no point to this exercise which I thought we all agreed was the most significant debate in the history of mankind. I'd hate to quit now because it's fun.
Very cool sidenote - The Blue Angels are flying around outside my office building right now. They just buzzed past and it was so loud I thought my window was going to shatter. No, I am not listening to Dreams right now.
Gaynuts - don't take offense. I actually think you have one of the funnier names I've seen on this site. I'm disappointed in myself if I've beaten you up in the past for saying non-critical things. I don't recall anything like that but I accept your word for it. I'd like to think I'm more challenging people on their anti-hagar biases than I am trying to beat anyone up for them. Not because I'm some crazy Hagar fanatic who can't handle him being criticized. Hell, I'll be the first to criticize Hagar for some of his lyrics and music (and for how in recent years he'd become such a schill for Cabo Wabo - thank God for Chickenfoot for no other reason than it's made Sammy quit talking about Cabo Wabo.) I just think many people out there don't like him because they never truly gave him a chance with VH. Reason being they were bigger fans of Roth than VH and didn't like to see VH succeed with Hagar while Roth became irrelevant. And I have no problem with someone if that's the case. Only when they won't fess up.
And see, I don't consider bSlash in that group. He's been able to articulate his reasons such that I am persuaded he believes what he says about Hagar. I don't think he's on this website solely to trash Sam. I think he just gives his opinions when the topic arises. Read some of his work in the KISS posts - pricelessly funny.
But there are others (like DLREngineroom) on this site who I suspect - just from their name alone and because you don't see them much on non-VH stories- that they have an agenda. They actively seek out VH/Hagar/Chickenfoot posts just so they can take their shots at Sam.
So as much as I do get a kick out of your name, I do wonder about the real reason behind your criticisms of Sam. You and I have just engaged here for the first time so I look forward to our discussions going forward. We never have to agree. Like bSlash, anytime you are in Seattle, we can discuss it over a beer and VH's first six albums. Cheers.
COMMENT | Sgt h posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 3:12:24 PM
you're a good man. I appreciate the well thought arguments & good debate....I loved the Blue Angels as a kid btw.
and I am not in that group...I was SO into 5150 when it came out, despite thinking Sam's previous work was generic, I was so into VH, it didn't matter...I find that album, not because of Sam, to be dated. The drums for that matter, electronic sounding, though the title track is killer...the returned to a purer sound on 0U812. And a better record IMO.
I am not out here to trash Sam one bit. As mentioned, I think he's a cool guy. He & M.A. seem like they really appreciate their fans. I respect that...I simply think the original VH is an alltime classic, barnstorming, kick ASS, all time party band. partly roth's attitude, partly early EVH kicked ass, it just captured kids imaginations, I remember when they'd come to the Boston Garden when I was a kid, the city had a general air of excitement. The last remnents of 70's arena concert rock at its best....and they never disappointed....I have that Zolzower book "VH the classic years" something like that, great! (photographer)...and I agree, Dave lost it by the late 80's. He too became a huge parody, more a clown later on. And Vocally, he lost it.
anyhow, I had an open mind to Sam in VH. I know he sings better, but I'm not a fan of his style...I had more of a problem w/him from his solo career. I don't think he's very creative, and generic. I do agree, simple straight ahead rock can be good, AC/DC, some Stones etc. I don't think Sam meets that criteria. I know we disagree on that...ok, i won't give up! ha....
In fairness to Sam, I think VH peaked creatively on FW, and commercially on 1984. I think the Roth VH would have gone more commercial as well. Or lost creativity. But to that point, I don't think the new version with Sam captured that magic, that lock up your daughters attitude the original had...the songs, VHII, all those first 4 albums have deep cuts(not deep emotionally!) that are just classic. Light up the sky, DOA, ripping all time hard rock tunes. I don't see that in Van Hagar. It doesn't match up, for me....In a simple Ryhme, I'm the One, On Fire, SGM a DR, Romeo Delight, Cradle will rock, Hear about it later, So this is love, mean streets, non radio songs that are just blazing!
COMMENT | btw posted by : BSlash24 7/30/2009 3:21:15 PM
I'll take you up on the beer as well, same w/Boston...the last city I've not seen in US that I need to see, Seattle that is.
and KiSS, I just like goofing around on those posts. They were huge to me in my early youth, so they mean something, but I also find all the trimmings that go along with the band silly. all the products, the Crazed Star Treky devotion of their fans. Comical.
COMMENT | Sammysgaynuts/bslash posted by : sgt.hartman 7/30/2009 4:10:39 PM
Thanks, gentlemen. Samsgaynuts - I promise I am not the guy that messed around with your ex. Although I wonder if it's the same guy that messed around with my ex-wife. By the time I found out the truth about that, I already was very relieved to be rid of her so I couldn't bring myself to do him any harm. But perhaps if you ever make it up this way, after we've had a few beers, we could convince ourselves that he is the same guy that screwed you over and then go over to his house and give him a blanket party. He's actually my boys' stepdad now but I don't think they'd mind. LOL
And I have to admit that if you've bought the albums and gone to the OU812 and F.U.C.K. concerts then you have at least given Sam his chance.
bslash - I'll definitely look you up if I make it to Boston. Never been and all my friends that think like I do and have been to Boston love it. So I need to go. If for no other reason than I love the accent. "Wicked Smaht"
I'll time my visit with a Chickenfoot show and take you with. : )
COMMENT | Sorry to jump into this conversation of yours???? posted by : joshtorock 7/31/2009 1:17:19 AM
Don't worry I am not going to mention anything about "banana eating jungle monkey's". But you guys are starting to sound a lot like Nobama, and his clan of "Move On" retoric's. point, Eddie Van Halen and Alex Van Halen hate David Lee Roth. Eddie love Sammy Hagar and Michael Anthony, and after Sammy left Eddie could not take it so he went into a drunkin stuppa, probably because he new he made a big mistake firing Sammy Hagar from Van Halen, and knowing he could never get those hay days back that were wasted from 1996-2003. Hens the "drunkin stuppa tour of 2004" were Eddie ruined the band even more. And believe it or not he wanted Sammy back for the 2007 tour or any of the tour ideas before. But, Sammy didn't want in to anything Eddie anymore. Sorry that's the facts jack!
"CHICKENFOOT" /|\
COMMENT | Joshtorock posted by : BSlash24 7/31/2009 9:28:24 AM
who cares? We know that, no one is saying Ed was a class guy when he drank. I posted many times I feel he TOTALLY dissed Mike Anthony, completely shitting what he did.
So when you so randomly say "get your facts straight", on a topic that wasn't even discussed, what the F are you talking about?...we all know Ed ruined that tour in 2004. according to Sam, tried to smash a plane window with a wine bottle. Despicable, if true.....and Sam, Mike, seem like great down to earth guys...so what are you blabbering about.
Sgt. Hartman stands behind Sam, cites examples, debates the merits of Sam, or Van Hagar era. I have said, there's some good VH post 1986 tunes....no one is saying ANYTHING about what you just wrote about. I agree with you....though if there wasn't a Chickenfoot, and MA were still in VH, if Sam were asked, he'd go back. Ed would just have to say "i'm clean"....EVH unfortunately, at least when drunk, is miserable. All the interviews I hear in the last few years are defensive, angry, putting down MA, Sam, and you know its his distorted truth.
So what are you blabbering about?...frankly I don't know or care who EVH likes better. I don't think you really know either, I don't think Ed knows. He's against anyone that he perceives is on team VH.
COMMENT | July 31st Deadline posted by : BSlash24 7/31/2009 11:46:00 AM
There must be a decision by Sundown, which version of the band is greater, if the 2 were separate bands, which is more worth of the HOF status> (yes, the Hall of Fame is flawed).
Joshtorock, give me a solid musical evidence in your debate. Ed's choice of friendship, DAve, mike or sam, is irrelevant. I am throwing that out, non factual evidence, and if it were fact, its...irrelevant....this is opinion, but damn it, the human race is in the balance over this debate. THe riots & hatred against both Dave & Sam just stop. An accord must be reached.
I've said my piece. we've had women leave us to be with Sammy or Dave loving guys....hearts have been broken from East(Boston), West(Seattle), and southwest(Tejas)....our ladies should stand behind whatever decision we come to...I stand by the original, THE VH, as the definitive VH.
COMMENT | I'm Back !!! posted by : joshtorock 7/31/2009 12:56:12 PM
The Van Hagar alternative to you DLR lovers, with a little help from the Sgt.
Sammy and Eddie were best of friends buying homes next to each other and making music that blended perfectly.
Nothing against the older days of Roth Halen, I loved those days too, but the magic disapeared during the '83-'85 years having Dave wanting to do his own thing and not being friendly with the band.
But Sammy and Eddie were personal friends, something Dave never was. As you will see in the photo (linked below) So stop buggin';
COMMENT | Joshtorock posted by : BSlash24 7/31/2009 1:54:34 PM
buggin?
cute photo, really. such fun times 20 years ago....they probably shouldn't have lived right next door, they went through a divorce. having great friends might not always work creatively, sometimes you need a person(roth) to be the bad guy & say "ah, that's lame, we're not doing that"...
Notice Ed did do that to Sam when thing went sour, he told Sammy his lyrics sucked! He went as far as saying #1, Sam wrote goofy Twister lyrics when Ed told him not to be so literal, and Ed went further to say "I never understood why Sam's lyrics were always sort of corny, lovey" etc. I forget the the specifics now, but when they were raft buddies, like Huck Fin/Tom Sawyer, it was a love in, no one criticized. And then you get a song like Dreams, or fluff. That song would have hit the cutting room floor with Dave at the helm, & pissed Ed off, but the fans would have been treated to a better more hard rockin' effort.
there, I said it!
Its nearly Cabo Wabo time here in the east, 3 hours away. 6 for the Sgt.
COMMENT | Here's my take... posted by : sgt.hartman 7/31/2009 1:56:31 PM
The singers really aren't the issue with how the band changed musically. Ability wise, Sammy could have sung the Roth music just fine. I doubt the converse it true. In fact, I know the converse is true. Roth doesn't have the range. I think it's pretty clear that Ed drove the musical direction of the band.
However, the debate is really about the musical style of the band. The Roth version is rawer, filthier, more in your face - a younger man's invincible, cockier attitude if you will. They were a young band new to the scene. They had to take on that initial struggle to make a name for themselves and that attitude is how they did it. It's hungrier music.
On the other hand, the Hagar version of the band is what you would expect from a band that has made it and can afford to evolve and change it up without risking too much. I think the musicianship of the Hagar era was better but then they'd been playing their instruments longer. No brainer. The sound was more polished. They introduced keyboards because Sam could also play guitar. Plus, I think Ed is one of those rare musical geniuses. I think his talent goes beyond just straight ahead rock and roll. He could probably compose symphonies if we wanted to. I think once Dave and his "me me me" attitude left the band -don't get me wrong, that's part of what made Roth so great - Ed was musically free to do whatever he wanted. And what he wanted to was to change the sound of the band here or there. And it's not like it could get even more raw. So you have a mix of tunes in the Hagar era. You have the hard rockers like 5150, Poundcake, etc. but you also have some lighter fare like "Feels so good" etc. Plus, I think Hagar's vocal range also expanded what the band could do musically.
I don't think one is "better" than the other. Depends on mood for me. I love them both. But I do so while appreciating the differences and why they exist.
COMMENT | Sgt posted by : BSlash24 7/31/2009 2:51:48 PM
fair take. I agree with that 90%. This is where I take a different view:
Roth definitely couldn't sing Sam songs, no range...BUT Sam, while more talented vocally, didn't have that attitude in his voice too. I can't explain it, so its hard to put in words. That "that's right, i'm THE man, and Van Halen is here to take over your town, steal your girl etc"...those adlibs in MeanSTs, everybody wants some...you can do it, but you won't have the same Bravado...that's the word....and then Roth's Whistle scream. Vintage...Ever heard the "running w/the Devil" on Youtube(now gone), with Roth only, just the vocals, its ClASSIC! And actually pretty good. VEry hard to replicate.
Hungier music, well said....I have to disagree they were playing their instuments better, EVH I feel regressed by 5150. Fairwarning was not only hungry, but extremely innovative. That part of his playing is missing. (he also delved further into drinking).
My main beef with VH, I don't feel they evolved, or mellowed(thats expected), but I feel they dumbed themselves up, sold out....I like lots of mellow music, its doesn't have to be DOA style all the time. I love AC/DC, but not all the time, while they never sold out, they also never evolved...Led Zep, the Beatles for sure, evolved on each record, mellowing, maturing...I feel VH's mellow stuff isn't so much mellow but pop....Dreams is cheesy in my book, not a band mellowing like a fine wine...I don't like "right now", but I will give you that one as maybe a band maturing. I'm thinking of better analogies.
Some bands evolve, mellow, maybe do a country or blues influenced album(the Stones), do it well. Others, like Aerosmith, just go more commercial. Sell out. I feel VH took that route...I'm not a Foreigner fan, but say Foreigner 4, total pop, on the radio 24/7, bubblegum. That's where VH was going, at times....and when they tried to rock hard, it wasn't as hard rockin as previous, more cuz Ed. his sound was watered down by then.
VHI & II were raw. VCFirst, raw, but the sound is more modern, FW, even more so, still raw elements, but more sophisticated playing, arrangements, production, overdubbing more....1984 more commercial, maybe too produced...heading in the wrong direction, but still edgy.
Lastly, Ed did get tons of musical freedom, but I think that's where it hurt. He need a barometer, he needed someone to say NO to him at times. he didn't have that. Like McCartney without Lennon telling him "that's too mushy"...but, that is my take only.
COMMENT | bslash posted by : sgt.hartman 7/31/2009 3:45:20 PM
In retrospect, "evolved" was not the best choice of words. I think "changed" would have been better. I didn't mean to imply the Hagar era was objectively better. Just different.
I understand completely what you are saying about it being difficult to put into words about how Dave's voice had that attitude that Sam's lacked. I just meant Sammy could physically sing those song without problem. I didn't mean to suggest we would all like them better if he did.
I also agree that Hagar era had many more "commercial" tunes, whatever that means, but I think it's because they could go in different directions with Hagar. I also think it had to do with the times. I don't know... seems like there was something about the mid 80s that just made established bands go there. Whereas the 70s and early 80s had a more raw sound when you talk about rock bands. Like you say, Aerosmith...Look at Heart - another glaring example of a huge band doing the same thing (i.e. Crazy on You, Magic Man, Barracuda to These Dreams, What About Love? Still think Ann Wilson has the greatest female pipes in Rock). Even the Rolling Stones to some extent (Start Me Up, Mixed Emotions). I think VH was already headed that way before Hagar joined when you consider some of the music on 1984.
So I do agree VH got more "commercial" sounding with Hagar. Like I said, it's probably because they could with Hagar's versatility, the times being what they were and Ed's desire to try new things. But while you say he needed someone to knock some sense in to him, I think it wasn't necessarily a bad thing. I'm just not as averse to it as you I guess.
As far as Ed's talent, I disagree Ed lost a step. I don't think Ed was creating as many new ideas sonically (i.e. Cathedral) but I think he was better at executing on the ideas he's already come up with. Check out his solo on the Live Without A Net video. Near flawless. I don't play but that's my impression anyway.
Plus, once Dave was out of the band, there was no way in hell anyone was going to tell Ed what to do musically. Ed was very vocal about his joy at being free of Dave's constraints and determined to never be so submissive again with his music. It probably worked so well with Sam because Sam had already been treading in the same musical waters as a solo act (i.e. a mix of harder and lighter fare).
So for me, I'll agree VH put out more commercial fare with Hagar. But I'll disagree that VH couldn't rock as hard with Hagar as they did with Roth they just threw some lighter tunes into the mix. Which was ok for me.
Also, on the RRHOF debate, the truth is we will never know if VH would have gotten in based solely on the Roth era. But we know they didn't. Otherwise Hagar would not have been inducted with them. That Hagar got inducted too tells me that the Hagar era was part of the deal. Why? Because they excluded Gary, which seems like the Powers That Be's way of letting us know what parts of the band they believe had RRHOF merit.
COMMENT | good points posted by : BSlash24 7/31/2009 4:11:17 PM
Sgt, you are spot on...and the mid 80's did bring that out. I find it to be just a terrible time in music, bands, musical trends, fashions.
Heart is a perfect example, they were bigger in the mid 80's commercial than the 70's but just awful. And I can appreciate their 70's hits. "these dreams" is sort of the direction VH was going on. like their label was like "yes boys, keep the hits coming"...and the electronic drum sounds. The dance remix versions of every song(don't think VH did that)....The Stones I feel just ran out of ideas, as opposed to trying to be real commercial, though Mick's solo stuff was more 80's.
one thing I respected about VH for a while, after dave, was no videos. to me made it more about the music. Even though I wanted to see a vid from them.
from all i've read over the years, Eddie was elated to be free of Dave dogging him. Mike A said Dave used to tell him what & what not to wear. That's tiring, but at the same time maybe dave had a good idea what was more edgier, more rocking...though EVH claims Dave wanted to do all covers on Diver Down...a fun album, but probably lazy on their part. Not to mention maybe 25 minutes of music, with fillers.
I will say one knock on VH, with Dave that I have, they were rocking but a very one dimensional band. It was pretty much always balls to the wall, flash rock. They did it so well, but other than "could this be magic", there isn't much variation. Much like AC/DC, though Ac/DC was one type of song even...anyhow, I digress.
Ed didn't regress so much as he got older, but I don't hear the fire. I do think he was getting more into writing, even if I didn't like the direction his writing was going...some Key songs were good, Mine all Mine is solid, feel so good, I actually like. Its not those real 80's sounding Keys...the only VH album I never bought was Balance though. Have never even heard it once.
COMMENT | enjoy the weekend posted by : BSlash24 7/31/2009 4:46:55 PM
I've still got a few hours to go out here. Tequila sounds alright.
Thanks for the post. Go pick up balance sometime. Granted there are a couple of dogs on there but I think some of the tunes on there are great. It's worth a listen. The Seventh Seal, Don't Tell Me What Love Can Do, Aftershock, Feelings.
COMMENT | "Balance" as well as for "Diver Down" posted by : deathmetal4u81 7/31/2009 7:24:25 PM
Were the only well produced and engineered albums Van Halen had, they also were the most polished of all the Van Halen albums and they were the most critical of the different era of VH, And as Balance was the end to the Hagar era, I think they would have had one more better CD if they stayed together. And like the 1984 tour, the Balance tour was flawless. Diver Down would have been the last album for the Roth because the trouble was starting to brew in the band but being much younger I think Eddie and Alex could deal with the differences to go it one more time with 1984.
COMMENT | My favorite is Woman and Children First posted by : vinny3888s 8/1/2009 1:59:57 AM
It was thereunsung hero of an album, stuff you thought hey here is this gut renching hard rock band starting to get all slicka nd everything, becoming popular and BAM they come out with Woman and Children First, they kinda acted like they were a new band or something, then they did it again with Fair Warning. But like you 2 guys above me i thought things were going sour when Diver Down came up. A lot of covers on that album. Dave probably wanted to do other things. But i also started to grow up and wasn't a headbangger, and started to like the Hagar stuff, got married and even the wife would listen and go see Van Halen in 1993 with Sammy. The also were larger than life and I think had the world by the balls, or you could say they were standing on "Top of the World" Thats when I relized it wasn't the frontmen that were the problem it was management and the Van Halen Bro.s that were the problem.
COMMENT | Hey gay left nut !!!! posted by : vanhagar 8/2/2009 12:33:21 PM
I have been on hiatious for a while. But I checked out that link and man that just goes to show you that with out Eddie, Mike and Alex, Dave sounds like a piece of shit !!!
Sorry but that link just proved it. Sammy would never sound that shitty and eeary.
http://www.thetyser.com/
/|\
COMMENT | WOW posted by : vinny3888s 8/2/2009 12:43:25 PM
Surfing, that was wierd, and if he sounded that bad then, how bad do you thing he sounds now. really scary, thanks for the link, and I'm glad they did a great reverb job to make him sound good on the first 6 albums. Sammy does sound good in the "DeJevu" and "Feelings"songs on Balance, with the acuostics. Also some one pointed it out that not once could you hear the bass on OU812 album, I listened and couldn't hear it.
COMMENT | eh, the whole ban Chickenfoot will be there. posted by : 1chickenhead1 8/2/2009 4:26:56 PM
the reason Surfin' with nuts posted the Roth clip, was not to show Roth could or couldn't sing better, but the subject came up about either singer being able to reproduce the other...I think that is actually pretty cool, unique. Love the screams, very rock n roll, lots of balls. No, he's not a technically great singer, his voice is more like a bar room singer, then he added that signature whistle scream, its classic....it fires you up, as a matter of fact, Watching Entourage last night, they played "on Fire" as they were in racing cars. It fit the scene perfect.
Love Ed's sound on Diver Down. Not sure if its their best produced album, Fairwarning has some great arrangements, production, layers, some might argue 1984(I find it too 80's)...by 1984 they get very "chorusy" on their production, too "wet". The guitar sound takes a big step down on 5150.
Sgt. I did know "don't tell me what love is for" on Balance, that had a video. Wasn't a fan of that one. I heard one or 2 others. Then that song for "Twister" which was not up my alley.
COMMENT | BSlash. posted by : joshtorock 8/3/2009 7:19:49 PM
I saw that link before and it sucks, Roth suck and his vocals suck, that just proves it, listen to what some of these posters wrote. C'mon, Give me a break. yOur a DLR lover, Hagar is the beter singer and lyric writer, especially after reading the stupid lirics to Running with the Devil. peeuueehh!
COMMENT | lyrics- JoshtoPop posted by : BSlash24 8/4/2009 9:58:07 AM
bad soap box to stand on, seeing Sammy is the worlds worst lyricist....you're post are just inane.
COMMENT | Vinny, I agree about OU812 album??? posted by : crazy5150 8/4/2009 11:53:11 PM
No bass in it at all, or at least I can't hear one?
And that link to DLR's voice, bluuck, that is really bad, shows you how much Eddie's guitar really make a song better, especially with those lyrics.
Hey guys, guess what I am going to see CHICKENFOOT at the Hampton Beach Casino in Hampton, NH that gig has been SOLD OUT since tickets went on sale, I already caught them at the MiddleEast Upstairs, and that was awesome and sold out too.
Want to see how they are seasoned with each other after all these months together and then Europe.
Psyched !!!!!
/|\
COMMENT | Surfin' posted by : BSlash24 8/5/2009 10:39:42 AM
exactly. Its ballsy rock singing/screamin'...almost as a rule(with a few exceptions), I've never been into rock singers that have "pretty" or trained voices. Steve Perry, very unrock. I recognize he can sing very well, but it sucks the rock out of a song. Like the guy in Starship. Its like Barry Manilow trained them....I'll take a young Mick Jagger(up to 1972), Tyler(who can actually sing too)....of course Mercury can really belt it out, but I like him cuz he digs down, gets dirty too, has some raspiness to his voice....my point, Roth had that balls early on. There's a cockiness, a solid rock voice....and Sammy doesn't even have that great a voice anyhow. yes better than roth, but...
COMMENT | Ballsy Rock Singing???????? posted by : trish_vh 8/6/2009 8:05:06 PM
What are you guys talking about. Listen Slipnot, Disturbed, and Creed are what you call Ballsy Rock Singers, but you dweebs are waying David Lee Roth is Ballsy, yeah he will be playing with your balls or visa versa. Ha Ha Ha, gay. Roth era Van Halen did nothing to compare to what Sammy Hagar did with Van Halen;
Seventh Seal Don't Tell Me Why Aftershock Get Up A.F.U. Source of Infection Judgement Day Pleasure Dome Humans Being No those are some Ballsy Hard Ass Singer songs, that DlR could have never sang the like of or even sing, period. You aren't very strong men, more like girly men, that like a girly singer.
COMMENT | Great post Trish ! posted by : Gunner1234 8/7/2009 7:16:57 AM
But, they are DLR lovers that won't listen no matter what. Just like the judge in the Miss America Pagent that went against Miss California, it's their way or the highway. I agree Sammy is the HARDER singer, more range, and can appeal to any crowd of listeners. Giving Van Halen the veratility they needed to be as popular a Hard rock band as they were a Top 40 Hard Rock band.
Sammy is harder, Dave is Limp.
COMMENT | posted by : BSlash24 8/7/2009 1:58:24 PM
come on MichNext. sam served up the completely chick rock. I said that he technically sang better. Steve Perry can sing better than that too, but its so whimpy. As was Sam's love walks in, Dreams, all that fluff...anyhow, its opinion. Trish, another girl, so of course you're gonna love Sam's sappy offerings...yes, I guess I'm being Sexist. But the generalization fits.
Such a civil debate regarding Roth and Hagar I will throw in my two cents.
IMHO – 1984 seemed to be Ed trying to branch into new territory, mainstream commercial stuff. Perhaps because it was a challenge to him. Roth didn’t want anything to do with it, keyboards and all. Sammy came along and embraced Ed’s new direction and ran with it. Sammy probably worshiped Ed and was happy to be part of the pop machine. He already put the guitar scene upside down with his earlier stuff. As a result Ed’s raw and innovating guitar was mainly gone.
I will agree with all who say the comparisons are worthless and serve no point. Granted it’s one band but clearly two different directions.
Perhaps if Ed’s ego was more in check there might not have been all the break ups and rehabs which may have led to a better RNRHOF experience. But then again without it we might have never had the edge in the older classics with DLR.
The stuff with Sammy is nice but being a guitar player I have to go with the old stuff. When things get polished and spoon fed to me I push away. Their fame was due to Ed and no one elsePERIOD
BTW - did I read someone say Ed wrote the lyrics? I remember reading in a Guitar Player mag years back (1984 era) when Ed was asked what he thought of the lyrics he said " i have no idea what the lyrics are".
COMMENT | Van Halen lyrics posted by : vinny3888s 8/10/2009 9:23:21 AM
Eddie wrote and composed the music, the Lead Singers wrote the lyrics and everything was tweaked together finally by the whole Band itself for the finished product. (i.e. Bass and Drum invovlement)
COMMENT | DLR is VH posted by : Dr Huge 9/4/2009 5:04:09 PM
Van halen would have been just another mediocre band with a great guitarist if not for DLR, give your head a shake. Schenker didn't make the scorpins a mega band, Claus Mein did. Hmmm... Stevie Vai come to mind? Give your head a shake, this was DLR's award, and the awards rock and roll hall of fame should be ashamed, what a farce... Sammy Hagars' best effort was not even top 10. Granted his best work was with VH, but it's the same story with Iron Maiden. Bruce Dickinson is Iron Maiden.. The End. Give your head a shake! it's what metal is all about!
COMMENT | DLR is VH posted by : Dr Huge 9/4/2009 5:04:38 PM
Van halen would have been just another mediocre band with a great guitarist if not for DLR, give your head a shake. Schenker didn't make the scorpins a mega band, Claus Mein did. Hmmm... Stevie Vai come to mind? Give your head a shake, this was DLR's award, and the awards rock and roll hall of fame should be ashamed, what a farce... Sammy Hagars' best effort was not even top 10. Granted his best work was with VH, but it's the same story with Iron Maiden. Bruce Dickinson is Iron Maiden.. The End. Give your head a shake! it's what metal is all about!
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